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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 7:00 pm 
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hardBOILED! wrote:
Hahah...its spelled condescending. And nobody like a pretencious little kid :lol:


I spelled it correctly.

Bigdaddy wrote:
Dermann you cant just blame the christians now....it from what I rember about the 3 days of crusades I did in world history is that the arabs and christians were fighting over bethlam I think? Or something like that but they were both being stupid oh btw ummm why would the christians fight for the CATHOLIC POPE?


You're almost right, but the Ottoman Empire invaded Jerusalem. That's like if I were to steal your AK-74 and convert it to a calibre you really hate. Also, the sacking of Constantinople was important to the Crusades as well.

You see, Christians are Catholics. Yes, that's right, IT'S ALL THE SAME. And no, there were no Protestants because Martin Luther had not been born yet and Henry VIII had not decided he needed a divorce.

Good day.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 10:34 pm 
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Well...catholic's and christians mostly believe in the same thing except for like that catholic's believe that mary was a sacred figure or something of that sort I think...

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 10:41 pm 
And their religion is based on self loathing! But you could argue that every religion dealing with the concept of sin is based on self loathing...


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 02, 2006 2:52 am 
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Bigdaddy wrote:
]There is really no such thing as being the good guy as it depends on what you belive...such as the Nazi's thought they were the good guy and they were doing the right thing....so in their mind we were the bad guys...


Ah, I love relativism. Any system of ethics where the morality of being a mass murdering statist thug depends on where you stand is bound to be oodles of fun.

DerMann wrote:
It was a religious war. They fought for god and pope. Sure there were other reasons, but the primary reason was to kill the non-Christians.


This doesn't really do justice to the complexity of the Crusades. Christian Europe was not some superpower using brown people for punching bags. It wasn't until much later that Christianty surpassed the power of another religion. From the Spanish Moors to the outskirts of the Byzantine Empire, Islam ruled. Only because Christianity later became so powerful(and therefore history has been very Western/Christian centered) do we tend to forget the power of Islam.

Islam was a highly aggressive religion at this stage. Muslims had already invaded Europe once, in 711. Muslims held Sicily until 1053 and they loots St. Peter's Basillica in 846. The Church of the Holy Sepulchre was destroyed 1009, by the caliph in charge of Jerusalem. He was a little crazy. It was rebuilt but under restrictive conditions. The Byzantine Empire was getting its arse flogged and asked the Catholic Church for aid.

The Crusades were quite brutal at points(despite the fact that many church officials opposed such actions, Jews were routinely persecuted by Crusading armies) but they weren't launched simply to make money or to kill infidels. The Crusades were, in many ways, defensive wars.

(This is not a critique of Islam. A Qur'an and Bible share the same shelf in my bookcase, somewhere between fiction and self help.)

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