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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 3:15 pm 
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I was under the impression that the M16 had a higher muzzle velocity..

Wouldn't that give it more stopping power, since the round is the same size?


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 3:31 pm 
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If the round was the same size of the 7.62 round, then yes, velocity would definately give it more stopping power. Let these simple inertia equations say why:

124(grains)x2323(FPS)=288052 ---- 7.62x39mm

60(Grains)x3259(FPS)=195540 ----- 5.56x45mm

As you can see, 288052 > 195540.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:00 pm 
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The M16A2/3/4 fire selector can be worked with the trigger hand. Not so for the AK's lever. Reloads with the M16A2/3/4 are faster, no rock'n'roll motions. The M16A2/3/4 has better sights. It's highly modular. The AK has a better reputation for reliability and fewer #&$@#&%#&%!*!#%ing springs.

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Ok well there is a very common misconception that the ak is inaccurate with a milled ak-47 against an ar-15 with irons they can pretty much have the same groupings


An AK CAN be accurate but on par with an AR? Not with the shitty sights that sit a-top it. Slap some optics or a Krebs peep and it will improve significantly. The AR is still almost certainly going to be more accurate, due to the cartridge and piston-less gas system.

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Let these simple inertia equations say why


Inertia isn't a quantity, it is a principle. That's momentum you have there. 5.56mm has superior kinetic energy(1/2mv2) and is also likely to fragment at high speeds. 7.62x39 is generally thought to leave a relatively clean through'n'through wound.

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Last edited by Feanaro on Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:03 pm 
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Sorry for my misnomer, I was referring to momentum, I guess inertia just popped into my mind. Thank you for correcting me, Feanaro.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:12 pm 
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DerMann wrote:
Sorry for my misnomer, I was referring to momentum, I guess inertia just popped into my mind.


A lot of people say inertia when they mean momentum. Easy mistake, though that won't save you from my lazer beam eyes. :D

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Thank you for correcting me, Feanaro.


No problem.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2006 12:54 am 
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Some tv show on the Military Channel did an entire documentary on the M16 vs Ak47. I can't remember what it was called though. What i found particularly intresting was a segment that showed Eugene Stoner talking with one of the main designers of the AK47 in an old video (possibly from the mid 90's?) shortly before his struggle with cancer ended.

Basically the M16 was designed from the ground up to be as light as possible so that troops could carry more ammo. Unfortunatly if the weapon wasn't properly maintained it jammed easily, and to make matters worse, the army issued it to troops telling them they didn't need to clean it. Later small comic books featureing cute girls were handed out that were essentially cleaning manuals. The Ak on the other hand was a WWII weapon on steriods. It was best described as a light machine gun, scaled down into rifle. It didn't have the range / accuracy of the M16, so NVA/VC didn't get into long range fights, prefering to operate from the cover of the jungles, seting up ambushes, and other close range fights.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2006 11:32 pm 
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DEFkon wrote:
What i found particularly intresting was a segment that showed Eugene Stoner talking with one of the main designers of the AK47 in an old video (possibly from the mid 90's?) shortly before his struggle with cancer ended.



Its Stoner with Kalashnikov himself!
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2006 11:48 pm 
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DerMann wrote:
If the round was the same size of the 7.62 round, then yes, velocity would definately give it more stopping power. Let these simple inertia equations say why:

124(grains)x2323(FPS)=288052 ---- 7.62x39mm

60(Grains)x3259(FPS)=195540 ----- 5.56x45mm

As you can see, 288052 > 195540.

You must excuse me, I'm probably the most ignorant person about real life weapons on the planet.

Doesn't the M4 fire more accurately and pocess a higher firing rate?

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 11:34 pm 
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the penetration capabilities of the ak-47 are better, compared to the m16's slightly better long range accuracy. it really depends on the situation though. long range and il take a battle rifle like the m14, meduim range and il take the m16, close range an im tempted towards and ak-47...

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 11:44 pm 
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|_}UM{--}G{_|FeAR wrote:
DerMann wrote:
If the round was the same size of the 7.62 round, then yes, velocity would definately give it more stopping power. Let these simple inertia equations say why:

124(grains)x2323(FPS)=288052 ---- 7.62x39mm

60(Grains)x3259(FPS)=195540 ----- 5.56x45mm

As you can see, 288052 > 195540.

You must excuse me, I'm probably the most ignorant person about real life weapons on the planet.

Doesn't the M4 fire more accurately and pocess a higher firing rate?


It is more accurate and has a faster rate of fire. However, the M4A1 is not the standard issue rifle of the US Armed Forces. The M16A4 is not fully automatic, it fires in either single or three round burst. A 5.56 round loses a lot of power after about 150 meters.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 11:55 pm 
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once the .223 looses its ability to tumble, its about as good as a .22

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 3:44 pm 
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Indeed.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 3:45 pm 
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Well I havent read the whole thread.. but I've read the same discussions in other military forums such as Fav-club or FMG.

Is supposed that when firing at targets less than 300 meters away from you the AK-47 is the best choice because the 7.62X39 bullet is more powerful than the 5.56X45 and the accuracy of the AK wont be affected be the distance. When firing on distances over 300 meters an M-16 would a better choice because its more accurate (although less powerful) than the AK.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:50 am 
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When I hit people with my AK-47 I wasn't worried about damaging the weapon.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:32 pm 
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Quote:
the accuracy of the AK wont be affected be the distance.


The sights, and sight radius, will still be shitty no matter how close the target is.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 9:20 pm 
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nice post resurection,,,

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 9:53 pm 
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Colt .45 Killer wrote:
once the .223 looses its ability to tumble, its about as good as a .22


5.56x45/.223 doesn't tumble. It fragments.

That said, even a .223 that doesn't fragment (heh heh, Wolf?, heh heh) still has more joules (energy) behind it. 140-ft/lbs vs. 1700+ft/lbs.


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 Post subject: Re: AK-47 vs. M16
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 8:58 am 
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NickBizzar wrote:
I just have a small question. Just kinda curious. I was wondering, what do u all think is the better gun? The Ak-47 or the M-16. I heard that the ak is reliable becuase it hardley jams and is a great small arms weapon. You see terrorists getting owned by our guys with S.A.W.s M-4s and M-16s. Is that just them who suck at aiming or if we had our guys (Meaning U.S. if u may) armed with Aks, would we have a better reputation? I don't know a whole lot about the Ak so that's why I'm wondering about it. Thanks for your answers :!: :P

That's kinda wrong what you said about terrorist getting own. Americans can hardly even defend themselves against terrorists, because they use guerrila warfare tactics to ambush them out of no where. So it's actually Americans getting owned by terrorists. BIG TIME. Iraq war is just another repeat of the Vietnam War, and is also just as stupid.

*edit*
Just reread this post after a couple of years. Jesus i sound retarded.

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Last edited by Huh? on Thu Aug 11, 2011 12:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 10:28 am 
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is the AK-47 better? don't know, but I'd say later versions are, personally my favorite gun is the Beryl 96, which is an AK. :P

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 2:23 pm 
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Stay on topic please this is about comparing two different weapons not two different conflicts.

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