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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 11:45 am 
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Different weapons from lesser known arm-producing countries have always been part of the plan for Alliance, absolutely.

Now, I tend to agree with BD that making replicas of Russian arms from communist countries is probably a very low priority, unless that particular arm has some improvements or at least notable/historical differences from its parent.

I guess it's just a matter of historical significance. For example, I could easily see us offering CETMEs alongside G3s, merely for the fact that so many people have purchased and use that Spanish replica. But then again, by that logic, things like Egyptian AKMs should be in too. Hmm.... watch this space :)

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:44 pm 
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Well if that is the case then I guess either one would work. I wasnt sure if there was the difference. :) What got me wondering was something I saw on youtube that there was a difference between canadian and american 50 cal ammo.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 12:15 am 
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Speaking of lesser known stuff.. :)
Taurus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXT3jWoWoJI

Uru SMG
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Shipka SMG
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ss2x-BwxD7Q

SAF
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvaGWcLymV4

MS 40
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MS240
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CZ-23
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CZW
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CZW 438
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VMS 07
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LAR M62
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MAS M4A
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The war studio should convey that feeling of gun porn :D

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 12:23 am 
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AllianceAsi wrote:
Huh? wrote:
Damn I haven't posted in ages here. Well I was watching Top Shot and saw a really cool gun. Will Alliance have sport shooting guns? I was thinking of the Razorcat 2011, only a 100 or so in the world so they aren't common to say the least. Basically a super fast version of a 1911: http://www.gunmartblog.com/2011/03/vide ... llcat.html


We will absolutely have all manner of target, competition, and sporter guns.

Both Eric and I are avid sport shooters, and, much as good racing games usually start with gear-head founders... well... you get the picture :)

So can we count on an in game clay shooting range. :wink:

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:11 pm 
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Sig p556
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFG_KSdL_Ew

SK-46
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KSP58 and AK5
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwNa5hcZY3E

South korea
K7
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfCeQyOf59E

XK 9C
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South Africa
Raptor 7.62
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:59 pm 
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i want to see like this i dont know if u already have this sub machine guns


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 10:11 am 
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The k-31 better be in this game or else I will cry a river of acid.

..just sayin :p

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 3:27 am 
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neostyles: I get that you're looking for 'lesser know' firearms, but Christ, some of those are either really generic looking or so horrendous that there's no reason to use them.

Especially since most of those look like they were made mid-late Cold War or post-Cold War, they're all effectually the same 9mm, 7.62 NATO, 5.56 NATO, or whichever cartridge in a slightly difference package.

Not to say there weren't a lot of really cool prototypes to have been developed, like the Stoner system, Johnson rifles (not really prototypes, but hardly ever used), and the G11, but you don't have to go scoure the internet for guns that are either generic versions of popular firearms (that VMS 07 looks like a crappy hybrid of the G36k and UMP or MP5) or completely abandoned weapons systems. The MAS 54 was completely abandoned before they were even really considered because the FAL was phenomenally better.

I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish here.

Some firearms that aren't very well considered 'iconic' would be worth including, such as the MAT 49, because they've history behind them. It's one thing to have somebody find a Johnson rifle and go "Huh, what's this thing," then read up on it to see that it was a contender for the US service rifle only to be beat out by the M1 Garand. On the other hand, it would be a personal hell of mine to have an advertised list of 200 firearms ranging from the beginning of the 20th century to the present, only to have to scroll through pages of shitty South American copies of German designs and failed prototypical rifles to find an FG42 or an Enfield No.1 Mk.III.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 1:03 pm 
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Having some weapons that do just that.. make me people go "huh ive never heard of that before." :) Ive been playing games for probably close to a decade and pitching guns for probably almost as long and guns like the M1 garand and the ump45 are all too familiar. I think a lot of gamers are the same. I think it would be awesome if alliance let you get your hands on that gun that never really made it into widespread use.

Perhaps im a little different as im one of the only people who isn't really knowledgeable about these kinds of things,but ive never heard of the XK-9c or the VMS. They instill a sense of curiosity in me. I cant even find them on youtube. The only way I know about them is through the ebook that guy posted. I had no idea they existed and I think that says something given everything ive seen in movies and games (although granted there is a bit of overlap.)


Now, I mostly focused on the modern era but im sure there are more "secret weapons" from al time periods. Don't get me wrong, I think there is a lot to be said for how alliance will treat the weapons. Its gonna be great to have an m4 that doesnt handle like a co2 airgun (the only thing I do in fact have experience with haha), but ive really been itching for a shooter that has weapons that I havent seen before.

Like I said, I am no dermann or spiffinz and I'm not familiar even with a lot of the guns that I see in people's pics of their stuff, so I dont think this should really be much of an issue I mean, put me in front of a line of guns, and I might be able to name half as many as you guys. :)

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 2:12 pm 
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#//neostyles.CD wrote:
Having some weapons that do just that.. make me people go "huh ive never heard of that before." :) Ive been playing games for probably close to a decade and pitching guns for probably almost as long and guns like the M1 garand and the ump45 are all too familiar. I think a lot of gamers are the same. I think it would be awesome if alliance let you get your hands on that gun that never really made it into widespread use.

Perhaps im a little different as im one of the only people who isn't really knowledgeable about these kinds of things,but ive never heard of the XK-9c or the VMS. They instill a sense of curiosity in me. I cant even find them on youtube. The only way I know about them is through the ebook that guy posted. I had no idea they existed and I think that says something given everything ive seen in movies and games (although granted there is a bit of overlap.)


Now, I mostly focused on the modern era but im sure there are more "secret weapons" from al time periods. Don't get me wrong, I think there is a lot to be said for how alliance will treat the weapons. Its gonna be great to have an m4 that doesnt handle like a co2 airgun (the only thing I do in fact have experience with haha), but ive really been itching for a shooter that has weapons that I havent seen before.

Like I said, I am no dermann or spiffinz and I'm not familiar even with a lot of the guns that I see in people's pics of their stuff, so I dont think this should really be much of an issue I mean, put me in front of a line of guns, and I might be able to name half as many as you guys. :)


It's not so much that they aren't well known ..it's just that they were either failed projects or never made it, because they just weren't good enough. I know plenty of firearms that very very few people know of off the top of their head that have a LOT of history. Asking a couple of a gun nuts isn't a good comparison, because we live, eat, and breath firearms. BUT I do not want (as dermann said) to have to search through a bunch of crappy copies of something that was designed better by another country. And I really don't want to use failed projects (XM8 etc). I want to use weapons that were ACTUALLY in service to countries throughout history. You may see them as "generic" but the fact remains that they are common...because they work. Most of the guns in games are in the game, because they work. Granted, their are some that don't make a lot of sense (mp7) to me BUT certain body guards, and what not actually use them for a reason. I prefer something that works over something I'm not sure what it is and I'm curious about. That's like comparing a chevy truck to a smart car/truck hybrid that no one has seen. You know the Chevy truck runs good and can do it's job, but you are so curious about the smart "truck" that you just want to buy it...then find out it's a POS (all hypothetical btw) I hope you get my point. I have been around guns for 17-18 years now. I've fired a lot of weapons in that time, and to me the "look" of the gun has no value at all. It's the performance, ergonomics, and the performance of the round.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 3:53 pm 
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Fair enough, but for me, the look of the weapon does atleast make it more enjoyable to use in a game. I cant find anything on a lot of the guns I posted either so I dont really know what the history behind them is. If a gun is a failed project, yeah, but what about the guns that people have just never been heard of because they were adopted in smaller numbers?

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 5:40 pm 
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OK, I'll weigh in here as there's merit to both arguments:

1. There are certainly a number of clones out there (witness the CETME/G3). While we will be striving to include every single firearm used by militaries in the past hundred years (yes, every one), the clones will probably take lower priority.

2. We will be including every single firearm used by militaries in the past hundred years :). This means we want to capture them all. After we'll finish the mainline ones, we'll tackle the others.

But since Alliance will be more a simulation than a nerfed/boosted/balanced gun game, there will start to be repetition since there were only so many calibers used. Yes, several 7.62x39mm assault rifles will fire almost exactly the same. But, to Neo's point, part of the fun will be the different look, feel, sound, etc. of each. As a comparison, Gran Turismo probably has scores of cars with very similar performance characteristics. But once you add the paint jobs, tweaks to the engine, adjustments to other parts of the car (suspension, tires, etc.) it gets interesting.

Point being, clones will come later (but will come), guns taken just at caliber-value do get repetitive, but there's much more to them than just caliber.

Everyone friendly now? ;)

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 6:16 pm 
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In terms of avoiding near-identical performing guns there are plenty of uniques out there.

The KAC PDW uses a new intermediate caliber that's shorter range and lower recoil but is heavier than a 5.56mm.

The TKB-059 is a triple-barrelled bullpup 7.62mm.

The COP .357 Derringer is a 4-barreled, 4 shot pistol.

Both Italy and Czech Republic are adopting new army rifles (ARX-160 and CZ-805).

I hope there are a large number of SMGs. They are my favourite class of weapon.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 9:55 pm 
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temp89 wrote:
In terms of avoiding near-identical performing guns there are plenty of uniques out there.

The KAC PDW uses a new intermediate caliber that's shorter range and lower recoil but is heavier than a 5.56mm.

The TKB-059 is a triple-barrelled bullpup 7.62mm.

The COP .357 Derringer is a 4-barreled, 4 shot pistol.

Both Italy and Czech Republic are adopting new army rifles (ARX-160 and CZ-805).

I hope there are a large number of SMGs. They are my favourite class of weapon.


Absolutely, temp. Good points.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 1:56 pm 
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AllianceAsi wrote:
OK, I'll weigh in here as there's merit to both arguments:

1. There are certainly a number of clones out there (witness the CETME/G3). While we will be striving to include every single firearm used by militaries in the past hundred years (yes, every one), the clones will probably take lower priority.

2. We will be including every single firearm used by militaries in the past hundred years :). This means we want to capture them all. After we'll finish the mainline ones, we'll tackle the others.

But since Alliance will be more a simulation than a nerfed/boosted/balanced gun game, there will start to be repetition since there were only so many calibers used. Yes, several 7.62x39mm assault rifles will fire almost exactly the same. But, to Neo's point, part of the fun will be the different look, feel, sound, etc. of each. As a comparison, Gran Turismo probably has scores of cars with very similar performance characteristics. But once you add the paint jobs, tweaks to the engine, adjustments to other parts of the car (suspension, tires, etc.) it gets interesting.

Point being, clones will come later (but will come), guns taken just at caliber-value do get repetitive, but there's much more to them than just caliber.

Everyone friendly now? ;)


NO NEVER! lol :p. I understand your point, but there are very few differences in a couple different weapons that use the same caliber. 1 could be a bullpup..have peep sights instead of open, but regardless the round will perform much the same as it did in the orginal.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:30 pm 
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AllianceAsi wrote:
OK, I'll weigh in here as there's merit to both arguments:

1. There are certainly a number of clones out there (witness the CETME/G3). While we will be striving to include every single firearm used by militaries in the past hundred years (yes, every one), the clones will probably take lower priority.

2. We will be including every single firearm used by militaries in the past hundred years :). This means we want to capture them all. After we'll finish the mainline ones, we'll tackle the others.

But since Alliance will be more a simulation than a nerfed/boosted/balanced gun game, there will start to be repetition since there were only so many calibers used. Yes, several 7.62x39mm assault rifles will fire almost exactly the same. But, to Neo's point, part of the fun will be the different look, feel, sound, etc. of each. As a comparison, Gran Turismo probably has scores of cars with very similar performance characteristics. But once you add the paint jobs, tweaks to the engine, adjustments to other parts of the car (suspension, tires, etc.) it gets interesting.

Point being, clones will come later (but will come), guns taken just at caliber-value do get repetitive, but there's much more to them than just caliber.

Everyone friendly now? ;)


One of the common examples given by the Alliance team was the 1930s Czech Rifle Platoon vs. Navy SEALS or something like that. The Czechs used the VZ-24 rifle, which was a modified version of the G98 (a bit shorter, retained the straight bolt, differend sights). This happens to be the Mauser rifle that i own. So is this another confirmed weapon?

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:01 am 
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NO NEVER! lol :p. I understand your point, but there are very few differences in a couple different weapons that use the same caliber. 1 could be a bullpup..have peep sights instead of open, but regardless the round will perform much the same as it did in the orginal.

Im no expert, but I doubt the MP5 and the betetta m9 handle just like each other just because both use 9mm...

How about some spanish weapons?

FR-7
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Switzerland

Schmidt ruben K31
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USA
MAX 31A
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 12:47 pm 
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Why does that rifle look like it has a gas tube underneath the barrel AND a bolt action?

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:40 pm 
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DerMann wrote:
Why does that rifle look like it has a gas tube underneath the barrel AND a bolt action?



I believe its just a cosmetic feature on the FR-7 they probably store cleaning stuff and extra parts in it.

That aint the only gun with an odd faux gas tube theres another bolt action rifle that was a conversion of some semi auto and it was a hold-over. If i recall correctly. Might be a french made gun

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 5:51 pm 
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#//neostyles.CD wrote:
Quote:
NO NEVER! lol :p. I understand your point, but there are very few differences in a couple different weapons that use the same caliber. 1 could be a bullpup..have peep sights instead of open, but regardless the round will perform much the same as it did in the orginal.

Im no expert, but I doubt the MP5 and the betetta m9 handle just like each other just because both use 9mm...

How about some spanish weapons?

FR-7
Image

Switzerland

Schmidt ruben K31
Image

USA
MAX 31A
Image

Comparing a sub-machinegun to a pistol? Those are two entirely different weapons. And my point obviously went over your head like a plane in the sky. Also I already suggested the k31 and the very last weapon you suggested ..is a horrible choice in every way shape or form. Name one military that uses it?

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